[Micronet] MatLab town hall reminder

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[Micronet] MatLab town hall reminder

Ist-Comm Departmental
Good afternoon,

This is a reminder that IST is holding a town hall meeting Tuesday,
November 2, 2010, 2:30–4:00 pm, in Sibley Auditorium, to provide an
opportunity to discuss the future of MATLAB licensing. Details about the
upcoming licensing changes were published in an iNews article:
http://inews.berkeley.edu/articles/Oct-Nov2010/MATLAB

We are looking for feedback, particularly from the MATLAB user community,
regarding the TAH vs non-TAH licensing and the central vs local
administration decisions. You may also provide comments, or ask further
questions, via email, [hidden email].

Regards,
Your colleagues in IST


 
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[Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

jon kuroda
It's been a few weeks since this town hall and I haven't heard
anything about this since then.

To reiterate a point I made both on Micronet and also repeatedly
at the Town Hall:

> I think it is, but I think the only way to really know is to get a full
> price list reflecting TAH and non-TAH pricing for all the toolboxes so
> that one can "do the math" and compare the cost of the core-license plus
> the cost of toolboxes not included in the basic package and then factor
> in the cost of current hassles with licensing.

Without concrete information about pricing and other details, I don't
think anyone can really say what is "the right thing to do."

That means price lists put up online for everyone to see.  That means
putting up the concrete descriptions of the discounts that can be had
at different scales.  That means putting up a list of what is covered
under the different licensing proposals and what's not.

That means sharing information widely and openly so everyone can look
at it themselves and run the numbers themselves.

It doesn't mean "Oh, just send me an email.  I'll run the numbers for
you and reply with how much it will cost you."  That's not OE.

I think Harold "got it" after I came back to this a few times.

I look forward to seeing all this information being made available.

--Jon

On Mon, Nov 01, 2010 at 05:10:40PM -0700, [hidden email] wrote:

> Good afternoon,
>
> This is a reminder that IST is holding a town hall meeting Tuesday,
> November 2, 2010, 2:30?4:00 pm, in Sibley Auditorium, to provide an
> opportunity to discuss the future of MATLAB licensing. Details about the
> upcoming licensing changes were published in an iNews article:
> http://inews.berkeley.edu/articles/Oct-Nov2010/MATLAB
>
> We are looking for feedback, particularly from the MATLAB user community,
> regarding the TAH vs non-TAH licensing and the central vs local
> administration decisions. You may also provide comments, or ask further
> questions, via email, [hidden email].
>
> Regards,
> Your colleagues in IST
>
>
>  
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> To learn more about Micronet, including how to subscribe to or unsubscribe from its mailing list and how to find out about upcoming meetings, please visit the Micronet Web site:
>
> http://micronet.berkeley.edu
>
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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

Tom Holub
On 11/28/10 7:55 PM, jon kuroda wrote:

> It's been a few weeks since this town hall and I haven't heard
> anything about this since then.
>
> To reiterate a point I made both on Micronet and also repeatedly
> at the Town Hall:
>
>> I think it is, but I think the only way to really know is to get a full
>> price list reflecting TAH and non-TAH pricing for all the toolboxes so
>> that one can "do the math" and compare the cost of the core-license plus
>> the cost of toolboxes not included in the basic package and then factor
>> in the cost of current hassles with licensing.
>
> Without concrete information about pricing and other details, I don't
> think anyone can really say what is "the right thing to do."
>
> That means price lists put up online for everyone to see.  That means
> putting up the concrete descriptions of the discounts that can be had
> at different scales.  That means putting up a list of what is covered
> under the different licensing proposals and what's not.

I agree that this information is more or less required to make rational
decisions about licensing.  The problem is, the vendors don't want you
to have that information, and they really don't want you to put it on a
web site.  As soon as a price is put on a web site somewhere, they can't
ever charge anyone more than that price.

So while I too would like to see more transparency in our vendor
negotiations, I can understand the difficulty of implementing anything
useful.  That's partly why it looks to me like solving the licensing
problem requires some mechanism (FTE-based head tax, grant indirects,
etc.) which brings money together before the deal is negotiated.  I
don't think we can effectively negotiate contracts in an environment
with asymmetrical knowledge.

--
Tom Holub ([hidden email], 510-642-9069)
Director of Computing, College of Letters & Science
101.D Durant Hall
<http://LSCR.berkeley.edu/>


 
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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

jon kuroda
On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 12:31:15PM -0800, Tom Holub wrote:

> On 11/28/10 7:55 PM, jon kuroda wrote:
> > It's been a few weeks since this town hall and I haven't heard
> > anything about this since then.
> >
> > To reiterate a point I made both on Micronet and also repeatedly
> > at the Town Hall:
> >
> >> I think it is, but I think the only way to really know is to get a full
> >> price list reflecting TAH and non-TAH pricing for all the toolboxes so
> >> that one can "do the math" and compare the cost of the core-license plus
> >> the cost of toolboxes not included in the basic package and then factor
> >> in the cost of current hassles with licensing.
> >
> > Without concrete information about pricing and other details, I don't
> > think anyone can really say what is "the right thing to do."
> >
> > That means price lists put up online for everyone to see.  That means
> > putting up the concrete descriptions of the discounts that can be had
> > at different scales.  That means putting up a list of what is covered
> > under the different licensing proposals and what's not.
>
> I agree that this information is more or less required to make rational
> decisions about licensing.  The problem is, the vendors don't want you
> to have that information, and they really don't want you to put it on a
> web site.  As soon as a price is put on a web site somewhere, they can't
> ever charge anyone more than that price.
>
> So while I too would like to see more transparency in our vendor
> negotiations, I can understand the difficulty of implementing anything
> useful.  That's partly why it looks to me like solving the licensing
> problem requires some mechanism (FTE-based head tax, grant indirects,
> etc.) which brings money together before the deal is negotiated.  I
> don't think we can effectively negotiate contracts in an environment
> with asymmetrical knowledge.

Put it up behind Calnet authentication.  One can even be picky about
who specifically gets to see it.  Define "Everyone" to mean "Everyone
on Campus who cares about it."

Send it to known individuals on campus who ask.  Just don't make me
(or anyone else) have to ask [hidden email] everytime I
want to figure out the cost on a different set of toolboxes.  

--Jon


 
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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

Steven Hansen
In reply to this post by Tom Holub

> I agree that this information is more or less required to make rational
> decisions about licensing.  The problem is, the vendors don't want you
> to have that information, and they really don't want you to put it on a
> web site.  As soon as a price is put on a web site somewhere, they can't
> ever charge anyone more than that price.

When I managed Matlab, every year The Mathworks sent us a tiered price list
broken down by toolbox.  This price list is not available on the web,
they would
send it to us as a PDF.  I'm pretty sure the price list still exists
otherwise we would
not have been able to buy new matlab licenses for the past few years...
I think it
would be a simple matter of putting the PDF up on bspace so only people
with a
calnet id can access it.

~Steven

 
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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

Harold Pakulat
In reply to this post by jon kuroda
A quick update on this topic.  We will post local pricing for the the MatLab group licensing in the next few days, and at the same time provide an individualized renewal invoice for users of concurrent licenses.  We'll announce the availability of this information through micronet.  While MatLab publishes pricing on their site, there are local price differences because in some cases we have stock on hand that is typically available at a price lower then the new MatLab prices.

Harold
_____________________________
Harold Pakulat
Manager, IST Service Desk
University of California, Berkeley
510-725-2139


jon kuroda wrote:

> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 12:31:15PM -0800, Tom Holub wrote:
>  
>> On 11/28/10 7:55 PM, jon kuroda wrote:
>>    
>>> It's been a few weeks since this town hall and I haven't heard
>>> anything about this since then.
>>>
>>> To reiterate a point I made both on Micronet and also repeatedly
>>> at the Town Hall:
>>>
>>>      
>>>> I think it is, but I think the only way to really know is to get a full
>>>> price list reflecting TAH and non-TAH pricing for all the toolboxes so
>>>> that one can "do the math" and compare the cost of the core-license plus
>>>> the cost of toolboxes not included in the basic package and then factor
>>>> in the cost of current hassles with licensing.
>>>>        
>>> Without concrete information about pricing and other details, I don't
>>> think anyone can really say what is "the right thing to do."
>>>
>>> That means price lists put up online for everyone to see.  That means
>>> putting up the concrete descriptions of the discounts that can be had
>>> at different scales.  That means putting up a list of what is covered
>>> under the different licensing proposals and what's not.
>>>      
>> I agree that this information is more or less required to make rational
>> decisions about licensing.  The problem is, the vendors don't want you
>> to have that information, and they really don't want you to put it on a
>> web site.  As soon as a price is put on a web site somewhere, they can't
>> ever charge anyone more than that price.
>>
>> So while I too would like to see more transparency in our vendor
>> negotiations, I can understand the difficulty of implementing anything
>> useful.  That's partly why it looks to me like solving the licensing
>> problem requires some mechanism (FTE-based head tax, grant indirects,
>> etc.) which brings money together before the deal is negotiated.  I
>> don't think we can effectively negotiate contracts in an environment
>> with asymmetrical knowledge.
>>    
>
> Put it up behind Calnet authentication.  One can even be picky about
> who specifically gets to see it.  Define "Everyone" to mean "Everyone
> on Campus who cares about it."
>
> Send it to known individuals on campus who ask.  Just don't make me
> (or anyone else) have to ask [hidden email] everytime I
> want to figure out the cost on a different set of toolboxes.  
>
> --Jon
>
>  
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> The following was automatically added to this message by the list server:
>
> To learn more about Micronet, including how to subscribe to or unsubscribe from its mailing list and how to find out about upcoming meetings, please visit the Micronet Web site:
>
> http://micronet.berkeley.edu
>
> Messages you send to this mailing list are public and world-viewable, and the list's archives can be browsed and searched on the Internet.  This means these messages can be viewed by (among others) your bosses, prospective employers, and people who have known you in the past.
>  


 
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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

Marilyn Saarni-2
This will include renewals?  Has that been figured out?  (I notice you only have concurrent license renewal invoices listed below; I manage only group licenses.)
- Marilyn

On Dec 1, 2010, at 11:11 AM, Harold Pakulat wrote:

> A quick update on this topic.  We will post local pricing for the the MatLab group licensing in the next few days, and at the same time provide an individualized renewal invoice for users of concurrent licenses.  We'll announce the availability of this information through micronet.  While MatLab publishes pricing on their site, there are local price differences because in some cases we have stock on hand that is typically available at a price lower then the new MatLab prices.
>
> Harold
> _____________________________
> Harold Pakulat
> Manager, IST Service Desk
> University of California, Berkeley
> 510-725-2139
>
>
> jon kuroda wrote:
>> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 12:31:15PM -0800, Tom Holub wrote:
>>
>>> On 11/28/10 7:55 PM, jon kuroda wrote:
>>>
>>>> It's been a few weeks since this town hall and I haven't heard
>>>> anything about this since then.
>>>>
>>>> To reiterate a point I made both on Micronet and also repeatedly
>>>> at the Town Hall:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I think it is, but I think the only way to really know is to get a full
>>>>> price list reflecting TAH and non-TAH pricing for all the toolboxes so
>>>>> that one can "do the math" and compare the cost of the core-license plus
>>>>> the cost of toolboxes not included in the basic package and then factor
>>>>> in the cost of current hassles with licensing.
>>>>>
>>>> Without concrete information about pricing and other details, I don't
>>>> think anyone can really say what is "the right thing to do."
>>>>
>>>> That means price lists put up online for everyone to see.  That means
>>>> putting up the concrete descriptions of the discounts that can be had
>>>> at different scales.  That means putting up a list of what is covered
>>>> under the different licensing proposals and what's not.
>>>>
>>> I agree that this information is more or less required to make rational
>>> decisions about licensing.  The problem is, the vendors don't want you
>>> to have that information, and they really don't want you to put it on a
>>> web site.  As soon as a price is put on a web site somewhere, they can't
>>> ever charge anyone more than that price.
>>>
>>> So while I too would like to see more transparency in our vendor
>>> negotiations, I can understand the difficulty of implementing anything
>>> useful.  That's partly why it looks to me like solving the licensing
>>> problem requires some mechanism (FTE-based head tax, grant indirects,
>>> etc.) which brings money together before the deal is negotiated.  I
>>> don't think we can effectively negotiate contracts in an environment
>>> with asymmetrical knowledge.
>>>
>>
>> Put it up behind Calnet authentication.  One can even be picky about
>> who specifically gets to see it.  Define "Everyone" to mean "Everyone
>> on Campus who cares about it."
>>
>> Send it to known individuals on campus who ask.  Just don't make me
>> (or anyone else) have to ask [hidden email] everytime I
>> want to figure out the cost on a different set of toolboxes.  
>>
>> --Jon
>>
>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> The following was automatically added to this message by the list server:
>>
>> To learn more about Micronet, including how to subscribe to or unsubscribe from its mailing list and how to find out about upcoming meetings, please visit the Micronet Web site:
>>
>> http://micronet.berkeley.edu
>>
>> Messages you send to this mailing list are public and world-viewable, and the list's archives can be browsed and searched on the Internet.  This means these messages can be viewed by (among others) your bosses, prospective employers, and people who have known you in the past.
>>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

Greg Merritt
(I think I have all of this correct...if not, please help me out,  
folks!)

At the Town Hall meeting, many of us in the audience were surprised to  
learn that UCB Matlab licenses are perpetual, non-expiring licenses in  
terms of use of the software, but came with limited-term (annual)  
support and upgrade rights.  However, licenses issued by UCB have  
traditionally been set with  hard-wired expiration dates intended to  
notify users of the annual termination of the expiring features.

Meanwhile, folks who were presenting at the Town Hall were surprised  
to learn from the audience that Matlab installations do more than  
simply complain about the expiration of the limited-term portions of  
the license; Matlab quits working altogether.

We have a faculty member who is not interested in upgrade rights or  
Mathworks support, but would like to continue to use the perpetual  
features of the license that he purchased.  How can he have his  
original license re-issued without the artificial expiration, so that  
he can continue to access the perpetual rights to the software at the  
version he originally purchased?

Again, apologies if I've got this wrong!

-Greg

 
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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

Kellsie Munoz
In reply to this post by Marilyn Saarni-2
Yes,this will also include the group renewals. I am working on both the Bspace site as well as renewal invoices now. It is the concurrent renewals that had changed drastically this year, so for those they are being individually written up & sent out. It is a fairly labor intensive process, so I'd thank everyone for their continued patience. Renewal emails will be coming from a new email address [hidden email]

In regards to the "perpetual" license. They are perpetual in that we own them, but the hard coded expiration dates associated with them were put into place as a mechanism for us to ensure we billed appropriately for the annual maintenance fees. We have had these expiration dates removed now from the global license file. Here are the instructions to update to the non-expiring file: 

Each end user will need to get the newest licenses file. To do this the user should Open up MATLAB and go to the Help Menu. From the Help Menu they should click on "Licensing". From this tab there is a Update Current Licenses selection. Have them click on Update Current Licenses and this will replace old license file(with the expiration date) with a new one (without an expiration date).

 

I am,as noted writing up renewals now & emailing them out. This will be ongoing for the next couple of weeks during which no-one should lose the functionality of their current Matlab licenses. 

Greg, for the faculty member you have mentioned the above should work & if he decides to forgo renewal all it should mean for him is he will not be able to upgrade to the next release when it comes out in March 2011. 

Regards, 
Kellsie Adams 
Matlab Administrator, Service Desk Analyst & Hostmistress
Information Services & Technology
University of California Berkeley
(510) 643-1987  [hidden email] 

On Dec 1, 2010, at 12:31 PM, Marilyn Saarni wrote:

This will include renewals?  Has that been figured out?  (I notice you only have concurrent license renewal invoices listed below; I manage only group licenses.)
- Marilyn

On Dec 1, 2010, at 11:11 AM, Harold Pakulat wrote:

A quick update on this topic.  We will post local pricing for the the MatLab group licensing in the next few days, and at the same time provide an individualized renewal invoice for users of concurrent licenses.  We'll announce the availability of this information through micronet.  While MatLab publishes pricing on their site, there are local price differences because in some cases we have stock on hand that is typically available at a price lower then the new MatLab prices.

Harold
_____________________________
Harold Pakulat
Manager, IST Service Desk
University of California, Berkeley
510-725-2139


jon kuroda wrote:
On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 12:31:15PM -0800, Tom Holub wrote:

On 11/28/10 7:55 PM, jon kuroda wrote:

It's been a few weeks since this town hall and I haven't heard
anything about this since then.

To reiterate a point I made both on Micronet and also repeatedly
at the Town Hall:


I think it is, but I think the only way to really know is to get a full
price list reflecting TAH and non-TAH pricing for all the toolboxes so
that one can "do the math" and compare the cost of the core-license plus
the cost of toolboxes not included in the basic package and then factor
in the cost of current hassles with licensing.

Without concrete information about pricing and other details, I don't
think anyone can really say what is "the right thing to do."

That means price lists put up online for everyone to see.  That means
putting up the concrete descriptions of the discounts that can be had
at different scales.  That means putting up a list of what is covered
under the different licensing proposals and what's not.

I agree that this information is more or less required to make rational
decisions about licensing.  The problem is, the vendors don't want you
to have that information, and they really don't want you to put it on a
web site.  As soon as a price is put on a web site somewhere, they can't
ever charge anyone more than that price.

So while I too would like to see more transparency in our vendor
negotiations, I can understand the difficulty of implementing anything
useful.  That's partly why it looks to me like solving the licensing
problem requires some mechanism (FTE-based head tax, grant indirects,
etc.) which brings money together before the deal is negotiated.  I
don't think we can effectively negotiate contracts in an environment
with asymmetrical knowledge.


Put it up behind Calnet authentication.  One can even be picky about
who specifically gets to see it.  Define "Everyone" to mean "Everyone
on Campus who cares about it."

Send it to known individuals on campus who ask.  Just don't make me
(or anyone else) have to ask [hidden email] everytime I
want to figure out the cost on a different set of toolboxes.  

--Jon


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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

Marc Buchalter
In reply to this post by Marilyn Saarni-2
Has anyone from Procurement reviewed and approved the license agreement?


Caveat emptor!
Marc Buchalter, Senior Campus Buyer
 Phone: (510) 642-2579
Fax: (510) 642-8604



-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Marilyn
Saarni
Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 2010 12:31 PM
To: Harold Pakulat
Cc: jon kuroda; [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

This will include renewals?  Has that been figured out?  (I notice you only
have concurrent license renewal invoices listed below; I manage only group
licenses.)
- Marilyn

On Dec 1, 2010, at 11:11 AM, Harold Pakulat wrote:

> A quick update on this topic.  We will post local pricing for the the
MatLab group licensing in the next few days, and at the same time provide an
individualized renewal invoice for users of concurrent licenses.  We'll
announce the availability of this information through micronet.  While
MatLab publishes pricing on their site, there are local price differences
because in some cases we have stock on hand that is typically available at a
price lower then the new MatLab prices.

>
> Harold
> _____________________________
> Harold Pakulat
> Manager, IST Service Desk
> University of California, Berkeley
> 510-725-2139
>
>
> jon kuroda wrote:
>> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 12:31:15PM -0800, Tom Holub wrote:
>>
>>> On 11/28/10 7:55 PM, jon kuroda wrote:
>>>
>>>> It's been a few weeks since this town hall and I haven't heard
>>>> anything about this since then.
>>>>
>>>> To reiterate a point I made both on Micronet and also repeatedly at
>>>> the Town Hall:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I think it is, but I think the only way to really know is to get a
>>>>> full price list reflecting TAH and non-TAH pricing for all the
>>>>> toolboxes so that one can "do the math" and compare the cost of
>>>>> the core-license plus the cost of toolboxes not included in the
>>>>> basic package and then factor in the cost of current hassles with
licensing.

>>>>>
>>>> Without concrete information about pricing and other details, I
>>>> don't think anyone can really say what is "the right thing to do."
>>>>
>>>> That means price lists put up online for everyone to see.  That
>>>> means putting up the concrete descriptions of the discounts that
>>>> can be had at different scales.  That means putting up a list of
>>>> what is covered under the different licensing proposals and what's not.
>>>>
>>> I agree that this information is more or less required to make
>>> rational decisions about licensing.  The problem is, the vendors
>>> don't want you to have that information, and they really don't want
>>> you to put it on a web site.  As soon as a price is put on a web
>>> site somewhere, they can't ever charge anyone more than that price.
>>>
>>> So while I too would like to see more transparency in our vendor
>>> negotiations, I can understand the difficulty of implementing
>>> anything useful.  That's partly why it looks to me like solving the
>>> licensing problem requires some mechanism (FTE-based head tax, grant
>>> indirects,
>>> etc.) which brings money together before the deal is negotiated.  I
>>> don't think we can effectively negotiate contracts in an environment
>>> with asymmetrical knowledge.
>>>
>>
>> Put it up behind Calnet authentication.  One can even be picky about
>> who specifically gets to see it.  Define "Everyone" to mean "Everyone
>> on Campus who cares about it."
>>
>> Send it to known individuals on campus who ask.  Just don't make me
>> (or anyone else) have to ask [hidden email] everytime I
>> want to figure out the cost on a different set of toolboxes.
>>
>> --Jon
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>> list server:
>>
>> To learn more about Micronet, including how to subscribe to or
unsubscribe from its mailing list and how to find out about upcoming
meetings, please visit the Micronet Web site:
>>
>> http://micronet.berkeley.edu
>>
>> Messages you send to this mailing list are public and world-viewable, and
the list's archives can be browsed and searched on the Internet.  This means
these messages can be viewed by (among others) your bosses, prospective
employers, and people who have known you in the past.
>>
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> --- The following was automatically added to this message by the list
> server:
>
> To learn more about Micronet, including how to subscribe to or unsubscribe
from its mailing list and how to find out about upcoming meetings, please
visit the Micronet Web site:
>
> http://micronet.berkeley.edu
>
> Messages you send to this mailing list are public and world-viewable, and
the list's archives can be browsed and searched on the Internet.  This means
these messages can be viewed by (among others) your bosses, prospective
employers, and people who have known you in the past.


 
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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

jon kuroda-2
In reply to this post by Harold Pakulat
Today's date: Tue Jan 18 20:29:16 PST 2011

Still waiting to hear about this info, but perhaps I somehow deleted it
in a bout of NYE revelry [1]

Also, it was noted (by Kellsie, I believe) at the Matlab Townhall, back
in November 2010, that multi-week or otherwise protracted delays in the
fulfillment of Matlab license orders should not be the norm, that, even
if 'spare' licenses were not in IST stock, fulfillment of orders by the
Mathworks via IST should not take long - or am I incorrect in my memory
of what was said on that topic?

Should one happen to experience such delays, where should one follow-up
on that within IST?

--Jon

[1] at some point, I recall there was an up-to-date archive of Micronet
over on http://ls.berkeley.edu/ but as far as I can tell, that stops at
around June 2010.  Has the 'unofficial' archive moved somewhere?

On Wed, Dec 01, 2010 at 11:11:52AM -0800, Harold Pakulat wrote:

> A quick update on this topic.  We will post local pricing for the the
> MatLab group licensing in the next few days, and at the same time provide
> an individualized renewal invoice for users of concurrent licenses.  We'll
> announce the availability of this information through micronet.  While
> MatLab publishes pricing on their site, there are local price differences
> because in some cases we have stock on hand that is typically available at
> a price lower then the new MatLab prices.
>
> Harold
> _____________________________
> Harold Pakulat
> Manager, IST Service Desk
> University of California, Berkeley
> 510-725-2139
>
>
> jon kuroda wrote:
> >On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 12:31:15PM -0800, Tom Holub wrote:
> >  
> >>On 11/28/10 7:55 PM, jon kuroda wrote:
> >>    
> >>>It's been a few weeks since this town hall and I haven't heard
> >>>anything about this since then.
> >>>
> >>>To reiterate a point I made both on Micronet and also repeatedly
> >>>at the Town Hall:
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>>I think it is, but I think the only way to really know is to get a full
> >>>>price list reflecting TAH and non-TAH pricing for all the toolboxes so
> >>>>that one can "do the math" and compare the cost of the core-license plus
> >>>>the cost of toolboxes not included in the basic package and then factor
> >>>>in the cost of current hassles with licensing.
> >>>>        
> >>>Without concrete information about pricing and other details, I don't
> >>>think anyone can really say what is "the right thing to do."
> >>>
> >>>That means price lists put up online for everyone to see.  That means
> >>>putting up the concrete descriptions of the discounts that can be had
> >>>at different scales.  That means putting up a list of what is covered
> >>>under the different licensing proposals and what's not.
> >>>      
> >>I agree that this information is more or less required to make rational
> >>decisions about licensing.  The problem is, the vendors don't want you
> >>to have that information, and they really don't want you to put it on a
> >>web site.  As soon as a price is put on a web site somewhere, they can't
> >>ever charge anyone more than that price.
> >>
> >>So while I too would like to see more transparency in our vendor
> >>negotiations, I can understand the difficulty of implementing anything
> >>useful.  That's partly why it looks to me like solving the licensing
> >>problem requires some mechanism (FTE-based head tax, grant indirects,
> >>etc.) which brings money together before the deal is negotiated.  I
> >>don't think we can effectively negotiate contracts in an environment
> >>with asymmetrical knowledge.
> >>    
> >
> >Put it up behind Calnet authentication.  One can even be picky about
> >who specifically gets to see it.  Define "Everyone" to mean "Everyone
> >on Campus who cares about it."
> >
> >Send it to known individuals on campus who ask.  Just don't make me
> >(or anyone else) have to ask [hidden email] everytime I
> >want to figure out the cost on a different set of toolboxes.  
> >
> >--Jon
> >
> >
> >-------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >The following was automatically added to this message by the list server:
> >
> >To learn more about Micronet, including how to subscribe to or unsubscribe
> >from its mailing list and how to find out about upcoming meetings, please
> >visit the Micronet Web site:
> >
> >http://micronet.berkeley.edu
> >
> >Messages you send to this mailing list are public and world-viewable, and
> >the list's archives can be browsed and searched on the Internet.  This
> >means these messages can be viewed by (among others) your bosses,
> >prospective employers, and people who have known you in the past.
> >  
>

 
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Re: [Micronet] Followup to Re: MatLab town hall reminder

Harold Pakulat
Jon,
IST Software Distribution has posted the local MatLab pricing for group
licenses on a new Bspace site :

https://bspace.berkeley.edu/portal/site/5a6ac7f2-1f3b-4db0-babb-601fc33ce9ce/page/697e1f29-0c73-445c-a11a-056571db4647 


It is open to anyone with a valid CalNet ID , and anyone who's already
purchased a license has been added to the site roster. For more
information, or to request to be added to the roster, you can email
[hidden email].
[hidden email] is also the next level of contact to
escalate if you encounter any issues with either fulfillment of a
request, or requesting an expedite.

Harold

jon kuroda wrote:

> Today's date: Tue Jan 18 20:29:16 PST 2011
>
> Still waiting to hear about this info, but perhaps I somehow deleted it
> in a bout of NYE revelry [1]
>
> Also, it was noted (by Kellsie, I believe) at the Matlab Townhall, back
> in November 2010, that multi-week or otherwise protracted delays in the
> fulfillment of Matlab license orders should not be the norm, that, even
> if 'spare' licenses were not in IST stock, fulfillment of orders by the
> Mathworks via IST should not take long - or am I incorrect in my memory
> of what was said on that topic?
>
> Should one happen to experience such delays, where should one follow-up
> on that within IST?
>
> --Jon
>
> [1] at some point, I recall there was an up-to-date archive of Micronet
> over on http://ls.berkeley.edu/ but as far as I can tell, that stops at
> around June 2010.  Has the 'unofficial' archive moved somewhere?
>
> On Wed, Dec 01, 2010 at 11:11:52AM -0800, Harold Pakulat wrote:
>  
>> A quick update on this topic.  We will post local pricing for the the
>> MatLab group licensing in the next few days, and at the same time provide
>> an individualized renewal invoice for users of concurrent licenses.  We'll
>> announce the availability of this information through micronet.  While
>> MatLab publishes pricing on their site, there are local price differences
>> because in some cases we have stock on hand that is typically available at
>> a price lower then the new MatLab prices.
>>
>> Harold
>> _____________________________
>> Harold Pakulat
>> Manager, IST Service Desk
>> University of California, Berkeley
>> 510-725-2139
>>
>>
>> jon kuroda wrote:
>>    
>>> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 12:31:15PM -0800, Tom Holub wrote:
>>>  
>>>      
>>>> On 11/28/10 7:55 PM, jon kuroda wrote:
>>>>    
>>>>        
>>>>> It's been a few weeks since this town hall and I haven't heard
>>>>> anything about this since then.
>>>>>
>>>>> To reiterate a point I made both on Micronet and also repeatedly
>>>>> at the Town Hall:
>>>>>
>>>>>      
>>>>>          
>>>>>> I think it is, but I think the only way to really know is to get a full
>>>>>> price list reflecting TAH and non-TAH pricing for all the toolboxes so
>>>>>> that one can "do the math" and compare the cost of the core-license plus
>>>>>> the cost of toolboxes not included in the basic package and then factor
>>>>>> in the cost of current hassles with licensing.
>>>>>>        
>>>>>>            
>>>>> Without concrete information about pricing and other details, I don't
>>>>> think anyone can really say what is "the right thing to do."
>>>>>
>>>>> That means price lists put up online for everyone to see.  That means
>>>>> putting up the concrete descriptions of the discounts that can be had
>>>>> at different scales.  That means putting up a list of what is covered
>>>>> under the different licensing proposals and what's not.
>>>>>      
>>>>>          
>>>> I agree that this information is more or less required to make rational
>>>> decisions about licensing.  The problem is, the vendors don't want you
>>>> to have that information, and they really don't want you to put it on a
>>>> web site.  As soon as a price is put on a web site somewhere, they can't
>>>> ever charge anyone more than that price.
>>>>
>>>> So while I too would like to see more transparency in our vendor
>>>> negotiations, I can understand the difficulty of implementing anything
>>>> useful.  That's partly why it looks to me like solving the licensing
>>>> problem requires some mechanism (FTE-based head tax, grant indirects,
>>>> etc.) which brings money together before the deal is negotiated.  I
>>>> don't think we can effectively negotiate contracts in an environment
>>>> with asymmetrical knowledge.
>>>>    
>>>>        
>>> Put it up behind Calnet authentication.  One can even be picky about
>>> who specifically gets to see it.  Define "Everyone" to mean "Everyone
>>> on Campus who cares about it."
>>>
>>> Send it to known individuals on campus who ask.  Just don't make me
>>> (or anyone else) have to ask [hidden email] everytime I
>>> want to figure out the cost on a different set of toolboxes.  
>>>
>>> --Jon
>>>
>>>
>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> The following was automatically added to this message by the list server:
>>>
>>> To learn more about Micronet, including how to subscribe to or unsubscribe
>>>      
>> >from its mailing list and how to find out about upcoming meetings, please
>>    
>>> visit the Micronet Web site:
>>>
>>> http://micronet.berkeley.edu
>>>
>>> Messages you send to this mailing list are public and world-viewable, and
>>> the list's archives can be browsed and searched on the Internet.  This
>>> means these messages can be viewed by (among others) your bosses,
>>> prospective employers, and people who have known you in the past.
>>>  
>>>      


 
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